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» Lions Redzone Original- One Fans 2010 Outlook: 8-8
One Fans 2010 Outlook: 8-8
Col "TheDane" Sanders
www.LionsRedZone.com
Aug. 28, 2010
The Lions added 6 full time NFL starters to this year's roster.
Kyle Vanden Bosch
Nate Burleson
Tony Scheffler
Rob Sims
Corey Williams
Lawrence Jackson
Two more guys who have started but who knows what we have in them, Chris Houston and Jonathan Wade.
Two other first round picks from the draft, Suh and Best.
Big upgrade but lots of work left to be done.
We canned our special teams coach and last week we gave up a total of 30 return yards on 2 KO's and 4 punts that never got returned. We have lost field position over and over by not being able to cover or kick away. That just changed. If we coud get a decent return guy our special teams could really be a strength of who we are. The Browns won 5 games last year thanks in GREAT part to the play of their special teams. Hanson's talent has been wasted here for years. While I hope we can score TD's instead of FG's, he may well be the deciding factor this year because I expect more close games. Advantage, Lions.
People are hoping that this improved D line will protect the CB's, but the reality is that the first part of the team that benefits will be the LB's, then the safeties. The LB's were expected to help in run support so much that teams threw underneath on them all the time. The safeties likewise couldn't give the CB's help over the top enough because of the threat of big runs.
Quick out patterns and slants will expose crappy CB's who play 10 yards off the LOS. The best D line in the world isn't going to stop that. So, Schwartz wants physical guys who get up on the line and keep those WR's from getting quick looks. This is where our D will make or break IMO. Now, by having safety help over the top even if they get beat the hope is that we can still keep them out of the end zone.
Here's my take on this years secondary, they're faster. Beyond that, I don't know if they will be better. So, the hope is that they can limit teams to FG's instead of TD's. Bly seems to be in the right place at the right time for the bouncing ball like last week, so maybe thats an upgrade. The Spievey thing for me is a wait and see, he was really good at Iowa. The injury hasn't helped and they're thin at safety with injuries so even if he does get time there I'm not sure what to make of it.
Jack Williams is a wild card, no mention at all what his situation is other than he hasn't practiced with the team. Is he average? The fact that they've held on to him makes me think they saw something they like. King is going to get beat and doesn't have the speed of Wade and Houston so I'm not sure why he's still here.
If they can get this D to force 3 and outs on occasion and give up FG's instead of TD's, they might be improved by quite a bit. I think our O is going to keep them off the field with ball control, it doesn't seem like we're running an O that is going to put up quick scores, more like long drives.
The coverage teams could actually provide more help than the D line for the secondary. The closer teams are to their own goal lines there is less chance of them throwing.
We'll see. I don't have high hopes for the CB's but I expect Delmas to make a big move this year. Most safeties, even average ones have a big jump in passes defended from their rookie year to their second year. Not all these passes were on the CB's. The LB's should be better in pass coverage if we play nickle packages and get Follet out of there like they said they plan on doing.
This isn't a "bend but don't break D". This is a D that is designed to force 3 and out but is hoping that they have a insurance policy deep just in case.
The O has impact players everywhere you look at the skill positions, another thing they wanted and now HAVE. Getting Hill was big, because if Stafford can't get right out of the blocks and get it done with this group, call in the guy with a winning record.
We are going to get beat by teams with better talent and coaching. We have some serious talent here right now, now its up to coaching. If Schwartz and staff can get their system in gear, they should be no less than average. The fact is they have a lot of new guys but these players aren't rookies. They brought in guys who have played at hi levels on good teams.
The secondary is going to be the test. If we can get Page and one more CB with good credentials before the season starts I would be very happy.
If not, they have a plan in place and for the most part they have the players to make it work.
CJ is a very special player who we should have never taken because we couldn't get him the ball enough for him to be as good as he can be. That just changed.
If they don't go 8-8 I will be po'd, because they did take Pettigrew over Oher and they have made certain parts of this team a priority over other parts that clearly are not looking so great.
» Lions Redzone Original- Turning the biggest weakness into the biggest strength in one season? The Li
Turning the biggest weakness into the biggest strength in one season? The Lions Defensive Line
Sam "HunterMSU" Fether
www.LionsRedZone.com
May 15, 2010
Turning the biggest weakness into the biggest strength in one season? The Lions Defensive Line.
It was early 2008 and the Lions were coming off the 7-9 late-season collapse. Head coach Rod Marinelli is looking to revamp his defensive line to a Tampa Two style line and was not a fan of the big two gap NT style player. As a result of that philosophy, the Lions trade NT Shaun Rogers to Cleveland for Leigh Bodden, thus beginning the darkest year in lions history where we saw the Lions DL become one of the worst in the league. The Lions went on to the historic 0-16 season which saw Matt Millen was finally purged from the front office and Rod Marinelli was let go after the season.
In early 2009, the Lions were left with the stench of 0-16 and a DL made up of old, injured, or undeveloped Tampa Two players. Guys like ex-bucs Chuck Darby and Dewayne White, undeveloped Tampa Two players like Ikaika Alama-Francis, Andre Fluellen, Cliff Avril, etc. With a empty GM position and pretty much all the coaching staff needing to be filled, the Lions hired former assistant-GM Martin Mayhew as GM, former Titans defensive coordinator Jim Schwartz as HC, and as DC, the old-school Gunther (yeah your automatic old-school with the name "Gunther") Cunningham, long time Kansas City DC.
2009 was a season of purging. The new staff had so many holes to fill it was hard to tell where to start. Both 1st round picks went to offense with #1 overall QB Matt Stafford and TE Brandon Pettigrew. The only drafted DL player was a small school prospect NT Sammie Lee Hill.
Coming into 2010, the Lions had Sammie Lee Hill, who worked into a decent starting DT. Aside from that, stop gap NT Grady Jackson failed, Cliff Avril didn't develop further, Jared Devries had a career threatening injury, and surprise camp player Jason Hunter worked into a decent rotational DE. Basically, the Lions had only one player who was a solid starting quality player, Sammie Lee Hill. In 2010, the Lions had the #2 overall pick while the NFL is in a uncapped year. What happened next was one of the biggest overhauls on DL we have seen.
On March 5, 2010, DE Vanden Bosch was signed to a four-year, $26 million deal.
On March 4, 2010, DT Corey Williams was traded to the Lions along with a 7th round pick in exchange for a 5th round pick in the 2010 NFL Draft.
DT Ndamukong Suh was selected second overall in the 2010 draft by the Lions.
Three new starting quality players on the DL in one season? Now that's something to get excited about. So this begs the question, how does this years defensive line fit together?
The thing to know about this new regime, as far as the DL is concerned, is the alignment. First, DEs line up very wide with the idea of the angle to the pocket helping to maintain containment. To go along with that, large DTs are favored to help clog potential running lanes at the 3 and 4 holes, potentially made easier to block due to the DE being lined up so wide. This also makes the LBs gap assignments more important. But to stay on the defensive line, overall it favors size and disruption for the DTs and gives flexibility to what style DE you field.
Kyle Vanden Bosch RE- 6-4 278 pounds, signed as a free agent from the Titans, is a solid, balanced DE. He struggled with his sack numbers in 08 and 09, but his pressures and FFs didn't drop much from his career year in 07. He is very good vs. the run, especially with containment responsibilities. He is also a powerful tackler who forces fumbles. As far as pass rush, he is a decent bull rusher with not much of a speed rush but has a non-stop motor. He may not be a 10 sack guy who demands double teams, but he is a quality DE who is reliable in his assignments and should improve both run and pass defense.He is reported to play RE for the Lions, the same side he played with the Titans.
Ndamukong Suh DT- 6'4 300 pounds. One of the best college DTs in a decade, all the stats you could ask for, very good measurables, ability to play traditional DT, UT, 3-4 DE, and even a decent NT just about the perfect DL prospect. He could be the key piece to this DL not only being good, but potentially dominant in the future. His great strength allows him to not only drive blockers backword but also throw them to the side and shed blocks. His short range speed is outstanding, despite not having that amazing first step like Gerald McCoy. Suh makes up for that in the next few steps, does a great job of reading and reacting to a play and once he gets to the ball carrier, he is a solid finisher. In the future, his abilities could give the Lions the ability to move him along the DL spots to seek favorable matchups and create confusion like the Giants do with Justin Tuck and the Ravens do with Haloti Ngata, but right now its probably best that he focus on getting the DT position down at the NFL level because the learning curve is steep even for a talent like Suh.
Sammie Lee Hill NT- 6'4 329 pounds. Small school, later round players don't normally contribute right away, Sammie did. He was possibly the Lions best run defender on the DL. His draw out of college was his potential to be a two gap disruptor due to his athletic ability to go with his size. He was too raw last season to see much ability on the pass rush but he has the athletic ability to get better as a pass rusher once he starts to learn some pass rush moves. As it stands right now, he is the Lions primary run stuffer. Although he is not good enough yet to demand a double team on running plays, he does a good job of holding the point and slamming the door on some running lanes up the middle. He figures to get a lot of snaps at NT on running downs even if Corey Williams is the official starter.
Corey Williams DT- 6'4 320 pounds, was traded to the Lions from the Browns. Corey Williams was a quality DT in the Packers 4-3 defense, racking up two straight 7 sack seasons before being traded to the Browns 3-4 defense. He struggled mightily there as a 3-4 DE. He was benched at times for a lack of discipline and was considered a underachiever, although much of that was just classic bad fit for a scheme. When Corey Williams was a disrupting DT with the Packers his job was to attack the OL first and worry about gap control second, whereas in Cleveland, they were asking him to take on blocks and maintain gap control and worry about attacking second. Williams never made that adjustment. He was still worrying more about creating pressure and neglecting his primary responsibilities which drew the ire of the Browns coaching staff. Now with the Lions scheme, he is in the same scheme at he had with the Packers and at 29 years old he should be physically able to do what he did for the Packers. I see him splitting time with Hill at NT on running downs and taking all the snaps at NT on passing downs. If he can return to form he could be a nice disrupting DT who can push the pocket.
Cliff Avril LE- 6'3 260 pounds. The former Purdue LB was moved to DE after being drafted into the Tampa Two defense. In his rookie season he was essentially the only pass rusher the Lions had, and this was mostly coming off the bench. He ended his rookie season with 5 sacks and 4 FF. In 2009, in the new Lions defensive scheme, he got a lot of starts but the production remained about the same. As a pass rusher, his primary technique is the speed rush with very raw spin, rip, and swim moves, and not much of bull rush ability. He was a victim of OTs pushing him wide and the QBs simply stepping up. Probably the most interesting ability he has is stripping the QB of the football when he goes for a sack. 7 FF in two seasons and only 15 starts is pretty impressive. As the likely starting LE, he could benefit the most from the DTs pushing the pocket and preventing the QB from stepping up. In fact, he is probably the best bet for the first Lion to post a double digit sack season.
Jason Hunter DE- 6-4 271 pounds. A guy few expected to contribute, much less start 9 games, the 2009 FA from the Packers had only two sacks in three season prior to 2009. He is another DE with average pass rush moves but a good speed rush. He isn't quite as explosive as Avril, but is a bigger and stronger DE that's not as much of a liability in run support. He, too, was often pushed wide and deep of the QB. I actually expect him to be hot on Avril's heels at LE and would most likely come in for him on short yardage while doing a good deal of rotating in on 1st and 2nd downs.
Jared DeVries DE- 6'4 275 pounds. The 33 year old career Lion was cut and then resigned. He was injured all of 2009 and prior to that he had his first season as a full time starter in 2008 and struggled. DeVries is about one thing, motor and effort. He offers little in the way of a speed rush and only a marginal bull rush, but is fairly solid vs. the run. In 2007,he lined up at DT on passing downs at times and was decent, so he has a little bit of positional flexibility. Right now you can pencil him in as the 4th DE and 7th DL, unless Willie Young and Cohen or Fluellen really impresses. At this point, he would likely be the last DL player to dress.
Andre Fluellen DE/DT- 6-2 302 pounds. Rod Marinelli's 3rd round draft pick for the future of the UT position had light production in college but was regarded as a good athlete with potential. With the change of scheme, his position was in question. He got snaps at both DT and DE in 2009, but wasn't very effective. He is quick and agile but isn't as powerful as his weight might suggest he is. Still very raw technique wise, he faces a huge battle in training camp to get the 8th and possibly final DL spot against Landon Cohen, Rob Callaway, and Willie Young.
Landon Cohen DE/DT- 6-3 300 pounds. 2008 7th round pick out of Ohio, another guy tried at both DE and DT but didn't stand out. He seems better at DT then DE due to being better at the point of attack then Fluellen, but he isn't as athletic. He is a very raw prospect that has amazing upper body strength (bench pressed 225 pounds 50 times in the 2009 training camp). There is ability there if he can develop the technique. Personally, I think he is the favorite to win the 8th DL spot with Callaway being practice squad eligible.
Rob Callaway DT- 6-5 320 pounds. The Saginaw Valley State product signed as a UDFA in 2010 and caught some attention for running a 4.98 40 time at his pro day. He didn't dominate his level of competition, but he has some physical ability to work with. Not likely to make the roster, he is a good candidate for the practice squad though.
Willie Young DE- 6-5 251 pounds. He was selected in the 5th round of the 2010 draft out of NC State. The tall, lanky DE was a productive college player with nice measurables. His strength is his ability to explode off the line of scrimmage and use his long arms to swim through the block. He also uses his quickness to be a better run defender then his weight would indicate. He is adept at diving into running lanes to trip up or wrap and drag tackle ball carriers, however his downside is playing too high negating his already slightly below average strength. Although a nice chase and tackle run defender, he doesn't hold the point of attack well. He needs a lot of development in the weight room and he needs to play lower. His quickness and fairly polished pass rush moves gives him the potential to contribute as a rush specialist as a rookie if need be. If the Lions keep a 9th DL player he will likely be it.
In my opinion the likely packages will look like this:
1st and 2nd downs:
RE Vanden Bosch/Jason Hunter
DT Ndamukong Suh/Landon Cohen
NT Corey Williams and Sammie Hill having a near equal split in snaps.
LE Cliff Avril/Jason Hunter
Short yardage:
RE Vanden Bosch/Jared DeVries
DT Ndamukong Suh/Corey Williams
NT Sammie Hill/Corey Williams
LE Jason Hunter/Jared DeVries
Passing downs:
RE Vanden Bosch/Jason Hunter
DT Ndamukong Suh/Landon Cohen
NT Corey Williams/Sammie Hill
LE Cliff Avril/Jason Hunter
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